[CALL TO ORDER]
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WE'RE GONNA CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER AT 6:31 PM UH, GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO THE CITY OF DUBLIN ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW BOARD.
YOU CAN JOIN THE MEETING IN PERSON HERE AT 55 55 PERIMETER DRIVE AND TO ALSO ACCESS THE MEETING VIA THE LIVE STREAM ON THE CITY OF DUBLIN'S WEBSITE.
WE WELCOME PUBLIC PARTICIPATION INCLUDING PUBLIC COMMENTS ON CASES.
THE MEETING PROCEDURE FOR EACH CASE THIS EVENING WILL BEGIN WITH A PRESENTATION GIVEN BY STAFF, FOLLOWED BY AN APPLICANT PRESENTATION IF DESIRED.
THE BOARD WILL THEN ASK CLARIFYING QUESTIONS OF BOTH THE APPLICANT AND THE STAFF AND FOLLOWED BY ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS BEFORE DELIBERATING ON EACH CASE.
ANYONE WISHING TO MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT WILL BE INVITED TO COME FORWARD TO THE PODIUM.
FOR EACH APPLICATION, PLEASE ENSURE THE GREEN LIGHT IS ON.
THERE'S A BUTTON THERE THAT YOU'LL SEE AND STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS FOR THE RECORD.
WE REQUEST THAT YOU KEEP YOUR COMMENTS TO THREE MINUTES OR LESS.
NOW WE WILL STAND FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE, ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.
OKAY, PLEASE CALL THE ROLE MS. MAXWELL.
MR. KOTTER IS ABSENT THIS EVENING.
UM, I GUESS I JUST NEED TO KEEP THIS ON.
[ACCEPTANCE OF DOCUMENTS AND APPROVAL OF MEETING MINUTES]
A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE DOCUMENTS INTO THE RECORD AND APPROVE THE MINUTES FROM THE SEPTEMBER 23RD REGULAR MEETING.IS THERE A MOTION? YEAH, I MOVE TO ACCEPT THE DOCUMENTS.
JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE'RE ALSO INCLUDING THE APPROVAL OF MINUTES IN THERE.
SO YOUR MOTION NEEDS TO INCLUDE THE DOCUMENTS AND THE MINUTES.
THE DOCUMENTS AND THE MINUTES.
SO THE ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW BOARD IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE REVIEW OF CONSTRUCTION AND MODIFICATIONS OR ALTERATIONS TO ANY SITE IN THE AREA SUBJECT TO ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW UNDER THE PROVISION OF ZONING CODE SECTION 1 53 0.17.
THE BOARD HAS THE DECISION MAKING RESPONSIBILITY ON THESE CASES.
ANYONE WHO INTENDS TO ADDRESS THE BOARD ON THE CASES THIS EVENING MUST BE SWORN IN.
SO IF YOU INTEND TO OR THINK YOU MIGHT HAVE SOMETHING TO SAY ABOUT THE CASE, PLEASE STAND, RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND AND ANSWER IN THE AFFIRMATIVE TO WHAT I SAY.
DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH IN YOUR TESTIMONY TO THIS BOARD? OKAY.
BEFORE, UH, WE MOVE FORWARD WITH CASE 26 0 4 3 A-R-B-I-N-F 25 SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET.
[Case #26-058ARB-AFDP]
WOULD LIKE TO SEE IF WE CAN ENTERTAIN A MOTION JUST UP FRONT, 62 NORTH RIVERVIEW STREET, UH, IS GOING TO BE POSTPONED UNTIL OUR NEXT MEETING, BUT TO DO THAT WE NEED A MOTION TO POSTPONE IT AND SECOND AND A VOTE.SO MAY I HAVE A MOTION? I MOVE TO POSTPONE CASE 26 0 5 8 A-R-B-A-F-D-P TWO NEXT MONTH.
AND IS THERE A SECOND? I SECOND IT.
[Case #26-043ARB-INF]
TO THE TOP OF THAT AGENDA AND NOW WE WILL REVIEW CASE 26 0 4 3 A RB, AN INFORMAL REVIEW FOR 25 SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET.UM, SO I WILL TURN IT OVER TO YOU.
THANK YOU AND GOOD EVENING BOARD MEMBERS, THIS IS A REQUEST FOR AN INFORMAL REVIEW FOR A EDITION AT 25 SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET.
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SITE HERE IS HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW.IT'S A 0.26 ACRE SITE AND ITS OWN HISTORIC DISTRICT, HISTORIC RESIDENTIAL, WHICH IS TO THE NORTH, SOUTH AND EAST AS WELL, SURROUNDED BY HISTORIC CODE TO THE WEST.
THE PHOTOS HERE SHOW THE EXISTING SITE CONDITIONS.
THIS IS AN EXISTING HOME, UH, WHICH IS A LANDMARK BUILDING.
IT IS A VERNACULAR BUNGALOW STYLE BUILDING THAT WAS BUILT AROUND 1900.
THIS IS A VERY WELL PRESERVED HOUSE AND HAS HAS A ONE AND A HALF STORY FRONT G GOAL AND ONE STORY SITE CABLE TO THE SOUTH ELEVATION.
THE EXTERIOR OF THE BUILDING IS CLAD AND STONE WITH A STANDING SEA METAL ROOF.
THE PHOTOS IN THE CENTER SHOW THE 1970 EDITION THAT INCLUDES A PORSCHE IN A GARAGE EDITION, AND THIS IS NOT CONSIDERED AS A LANDMARK PART OF THIS BUILDING.
ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE, WE HAVE SOME VIEWS, WHICH IS ALONG THE SOUTH BLACKSMITH LANE.
IT SHOWS VIEW FROM THE SIDE AND THE VIEW ALONG BLACKSMITH LANE AS WELL.
A QUICK HISTORY, THEY BOTH DID APPROVE SOME SITE MODIFICATIONS BACK IN 2016, WHICH INCLUDES SOME PORCH EDITION WALKWAYS AND ADDITIONAL STUFF.
AS I MENTIONED, THE SITE IS ZONE HISTORIC DISTRICT HISTORIC RESIDENTIAL, AND IT IS HIGHLIGHTED BY A YELLOW STAR IN FRONT OF YOUR ON YOUR SCREEN.
THE INTENT OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT HISTORIC RESIDENTIAL IS TO ENCOURAGE THE PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT OF HOMES ON EXISTING AS WELL AS ON NEW LAWS WHICH ARE COMPARABLE IN SIZE, MASS, AND SCALE THAT MAINTAIN AND PROMOTE THE HISTORICAL CHARACTER OF THAT DISTRICT.
THESE STANDARDS SHOULD BE APPLIED IN CONNECTION TO THE GUIDELINES, WHICH INCLUDES, UM, WITHIN ALL OF THE ZONING DISTRICT AND ALSO TAKING INTO ACCOUNT THE PHYSICAL CONTEXT OF THAT SITE.
THE GUIDELINES ARE CONSIDERED WITH RESPECT TO ANY ALTERATION, ANY BUILDING ADDITION, ANY DEMOLITION, OR ANY SUCH APPROPRIATE CASE.
AS I MENTIONED, FOR A LANDMARK BUILDING, GUIDELINES ARE CONSIDERED FOR THIS CASE SECTION 4.12, WHICH IS A BUILDING ADDITION CASE AND CHAPTER FIVE, WHICH CONTRIBUTES LANGUAGE TO NEW CONSTRUCTION NEEDS TO BE CONSIDERED, WHICH TALKS ABOUT THAT ANY ADDITION SHOULD BE VERY CLEARLY DISTINGUISHABLE, SUBORDINATE, AND SECONDARY TO THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE AND SHOULD BE LOCATED SUCH THAT, THAT IT PRIORITIZE THE VISIBLE FRONT ELEVATIONS, WHICH IS OF THE LANDMARK BUILDING.
THE PHYSICAL BREAK OR HYPHEN IS PROVIDED BETWEEN THE EXISTING AND THE PROPOSED NEW ONE, SO THAT IT'S VERY VISUALLY APRE THAT THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT TYPES OF CONSTRUCTION DONE OVER TWO DIFFERENT PERIODS OF TIME.
THEY MUST RESPECT THE SURROUNDING CHARACTER BY ALIGNING WITH THE PREVAILING HEIGHTS MOSS AND THE LADEN COVERAGE, AND TAKE DESIGN CUES SUCH AS ROOF SHAPED WINDOWS FROM WHAT'S ALREADY OUT THERE.
IN TERMS OF THE HISTORIC CONTEXT, THEY SHOULD BE LOCATED TO THE REAR AND PRIORITIZE THE FRONT ELEVATIONS AND SET BACK FROM THE ORIGINAL FACADE.
THE IMAGE ON THE RIGHT TALKS ABOUT HOW THESE ADDITIONS ARE RECOMMENDED IN OUR GUIDELINES, WHICH NEEDS TO BE CONSIDERED WHEN WE ARE CONSIDERING THE CODE FOR ANY BUILDING ADDITION.
THE MATERIAL SHOULD BE WAY TRADITIONAL AND ALL THE BUILDING HIGHS MUST SIT BELOW THE ROOF LINE.
WITH THAT, THIS IS THE EXISTING SITE PLAN.
THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING THIS REMOVAL OF THE 1970 EDITION AND RELOCATION OF THE VEHICULAR AXIS, WHICH IS ALONG THE SITE SIDE.
THE REQUEST CONSISTS OF SOME SITE MODIFICATIONS AS WELL AS A BUILDING MODIFICATIONS FOR THE SITE MODIFICATION.
THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING ACCESS FROM SOUTH BLACKSMITH LANE.
THIS ALIGNS WITH THE HISTORIC DESIGN GUIDELINES BECAUSE THE FRONT FACING VEHICULAR ACCESSES ARE DISCOURAGED WITHIN THE GUIDELINES.
BOARD IS REQUESTED TO COMMENT ON THE REQUESTED ACCESS.
THERE IS ALSO A NON HISTORIC STONEWALL, WHICH IS ALONG SOUTH BLACKSMITH LANE, WHICH IS AT THE BOTTOM OF YOUR SCREEN.
THE APPLICANT IS PROPOSING TO OPENING THIS HISTORIC WALL AND KIND OF CONTINUING IT TOWARDS THE DRIVEWAY TO MAINTAIN THAT CHARACTER ALONG THAT STREET.
THIS POOL WITH NEEDS TO BE REVIEWED AGAINST THE STANDARD BUILDING CODE AND ENSURE THAT ALL CODE REQUIREMENTS ARE MET AT THE NEXT STEP.
IF THE BOAT SUPPOSE THE LOCATION OF THE POOL, A WAIVER WOULD MOST LIKELY BE NEEDED AT FOR THIS LOCATION.
A FIREPLACE AND CHIMNEY IS ALSO PROPOSED, WHICH IS ALONG THE SOUTH SIDE.
THIS IS HIGHLY VISIBLE AND DETACHED FROM THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE.
STAFF IS RECOMMENDING THAT, MAYBE REDESIGNING IT OR RELOCATING IN SUCH A WAY THAT IT INTEGRATES WITH THE BUILDING AND THE BUILDING ARCHITECTURE.
WITH REGARDS TO THE ADDITION, THERE IS A ONE STORY EDITION THAT IS BEING PROPOSED, WHICH IS BEHIND THE EXISTING 1.5 STORY LANDMARK BUILDING AND A TWO STORY EDITION, WHICH WE CAN SEE HERE THE TWO STORY EDITION FACES SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET.
IT PROJECTS BEYOND THE HISTORIC STRUCTURE AND CREATE A VERY
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DOMINANT VISUAL ELEMENT RATHER THAN A VERY COMPATIBLE RE RESIDENTIAL SCALE.IN THIS CONTEXT, STAFF IS RECOMMENDING EITHER TO REDUCE THAT PROJECTING MASS AND ALSO RELOCATING THE LARGER ELEMENTS BEHIND THE 1.5 STORY.
SO THAT WHAT YOU SEE FROM RIVERSIDE DRIVE FROM SOUTH, SORRY, FROM SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET, IS ACTUALLY A ONE STORY ADDITION.
AS ALSO CURRENTLY SHOWN THE BUILDING FOOTPRINT IS ABOVE 25% AND IT WOULD REQUIRE A WAIVER AT THE NEXT STEP.
HERE ARE SOME PROPOSED MASSING VIEWS.
WE CAN SEE PROPOSED TWO STORY EDITION THAT FACES THE SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET.
SECTION 4.12 RECOMMENDS THAT THE ADDITION REMAIN LOWER THAN THE ORIGINAL BUILDING.
THE TWO STORY EDITION REALLY COMPETES WITH A 1.5 STORY HISTORIC STRUCTURE, UM, AND DOES NOT REALLY APPEAR TO BE VERY SUBORDINATE.
ALSO, THE NEXT STEP, THE GRADING DOCUMENTATION WOULD BE REQUIRED BECAUSE SLIGHT SIDE DOES SLOPE DOWN TOWARDS THE EAST.
SO PROVIDING THOSE FINISH FLOW ELEVATIONS AND THE PROPOSED GRADES WILL BE REQUIRED.
THE REAR MAS AS SEEN ON THE BOTTOM OF THE RENDERING IS PROPOSED WITH MULTIPLE VOLUMES.
GUIDELINES, SECTION 5.3 A AND 5.3 B RECOMMEND THAT THESE FORMS BE VERY SIMILAR TO WHAT'S SURROUNDING OUT THERE AND BE VERY COMPATIBLE WITH THAT.
THIS CUMULATIVE EFFECT CREATES AN IDEA THAT THIS HOME WAS BUILT OVER A MULTIPLE PERIOD OF TIME RATHER THAN JUST AN ADDITION TO A SIMPLE HISTORIC FORM.
SO STAFF IS RECOMMENDING SIMPLIFYING THOSE REAR ROOF FORMS SO IT'S BETTER ALIGNED WITH THE CHARACTER THAT'S OUT THERE.
I KNOW WE ARE EARLY IN THIS STAGE, BUT THESE WINDOW GROUPINGS VARY IN SIZE AND PROPORTION.
THE GUIDELINES, SECTION 5.6 A ALSO RECOMMENDS THAT THESE OPENINGS SHOULD BE VERY PROPORTIONAL AND REFLECT THE PATTERNS OF THE BUILDING WHICH ARE ON THAT HOME AND WHICH ALSO REFLECTS THE PATTERN IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
THE EXISTING HOME, AS WE CAN SEE, IS VERY SIMPLE AND HAS A VERY ORDERLY ARRANGEMENT OF OPENINGS.
SO STAFF RECOMMENDING CONTINUING WITH THAT APPROACH.
UM, THE APPLICANT PROPOSES COMBINATION OF HORIZONTAL SIDING AND BOARD AND BATTEN TO DIFFERENTIATE THE ADDITION FROM THE HISTORIC STRUCTURE, THE PHYSICAL BREAK OR THE HYPHEN AS SHOWN HERE.
IT REALLY LACKS THE MATERIAL CHANGES WITH GUIDELINES TALKS ABOUT, AND ALSO THE TRANSPARENCY OR THE SETBACK SO THAT IT CLEARLY DISTINGUISHES THE ADDITION AS WELL AS THE PRIMARY STRUCTURE OUT THERE.
THIS IS RECOMMENDED BY GUIDELINES SECTION 4.12 A AND 4.12 C BOARD IS REQUESTED TONIGHT TO COMMENT ON THESE ARCHITECTURAL DETAILS, FINISHED STATIONS AS WELL AS THE MATERIAL BALLOT.
WITH THIS, I HAVE SOME QUESTIONS FOR DISCUSSION, WHICH STARTS WITH THAT.
DOES THE BOAT SUPPORT THE RELOCATION OF THE VEHICULAR AXIS FROM BLACKSMITH LANE? DOES THE BOAT SUPPORT THE PROPOSED MASSING, THE LOCATION, THE HEIGHT, AND THE VISIBILITY OF THE ADDITIONS? DOES THE BOAT SUPPORT THE ARCHITECTURAL DETAILS AND THE MATERIAL PALETTE AND THE BOAT'S OPINION ON THE ASSOCIATED SIDE MODIFICATIONS THAT INCLUDES THE POOL EDITION AND THAT ALSO INCLUDES THE CHIMNEY.
WITH THAT, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.
DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY CLARIFYING QUESTIONS FOR STAFF AT THIS POINT? NO.
WOULD THE APPLICANT LIKE TO COME UP AND MAKE A PRESENTATION? PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND YOUR ADDRESS.
DON'T FORGET TO TURN ON THE BUTTON.
RICH TAYLOR, RICHARD TAYLOR, ARCHITECTS, 48 SOUTH HIGH STREET, DUBLIN.
THANK YOU ALL FOR COMING OUT TONIGHT FOR A ONE ITEM AGENDA.
UM, WE REALLY APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO AN INFORMAL REVIEW.
THESE, THEY'RE ALWAYS VERY HELPFUL TO KIND OF FIND OUT WHAT WE ALL AGREE AND DISAGREE ABOUT.
UM, YOU'VE ALREADY READ MY SUBMISSION SO YOU KNOW WHAT TIM AND CHRISTINE ARE PROPOSING TO DO HERE.
THIS IS CURRENTLY A RENTAL UNIT AND THEY WANT TO RETURN IT TO THEIR PRIMARY HOME.
SO, UH, THAT INVOLVES SOME RENOVATION OF THE INSIDE OF THE EXISTING HOUSE.
MOSTLY INVOLVES REMOVING THE EXISTING ADDITION AND REPLACING IT WITH SOME LIVING SPACES THAT ARE MORE COMPATIBLE TO WHAT THEY, UH, NEED FOR THEIRS.
I WANNA UM, TELL YOU A LITTLE BIT ABOUT OUR OVERALL MASSING CONCEPT.
OUR GOAL WAS TO BREAK THIS INTO PIECES THAT ARE COMPARABLE IN SCALE TO THE EXISTING HOUSE.
I DO WANNA TAKE, UH, A SLIGHT OBJECTION TO CALLING THE GARAGE SECTION A TWO STORY SECTION.
IT'S A ONE AND A HALF STORY SECTION WITH TWO DORMERS ON IT.
UM, THAT WAS DELIBERATE AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE SOUTH ELEVATION, UM, THAT WAS SHOWN, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE RIDGE LINE IN THE EVE LINES ARE ALMOST THE SAME AS THE EXISTING HOUSE.
AND THEN WE WANTED TO CONNECT THOSE THREE MAIN PIECES IN A WAY THAT CLEARLY SEPARATES THEM FROM EACH OTHER AND FROM THE MAIN HOUSE.
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UM, WE HAVE KEPT THE MASSES LOWER THAN THE ORIGINAL MASS, AND WE'VE MOVED THE LARGEST MASSES FAR FROM THE MAIN MASS AS POSSIBLE TO VISUALLY SEPARATE IT FROM THE BUILDING.IT'S 40 FEET BEHIND THE, UH, MAIN MASS OF THE HOUSE.
AND THAT IS IN KEEPING WITH SECTION 4.2 OF THE GUIDELINES.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO ALSO POINT OUT THEN WE TALK ABOUT SUBORDINATE, AND I KNOW YOU TALK ABOUT THIS ALL THE TIME WITH THESE PROJECTS, IT MEANS A LOT OF THINGS, BUT IT CAN ALSO MEAN BEHIND.
AND THE FACT THAT IT'S VISIBLE 40 FEET BEHIND THE EXISTING DOES NOT MAKE IT NOT SUBORDINATE TO THE MAIN, UH, BUILDING IN MY OPINION.
SO THE ARRANGEMENT OF THE MASSES THAT WE DID HERE, UM, IT'S A REFLECTION OF THE FUNCTION OF THE PLAN, HOW THE FLOOR PLAN WORKS, HOW THEY WANNA LIVE IN THIS HOUSE, WHICH IS MOSTLY FIRST FLOOR LIVING.
IT USES THE ARCHITECTURAL ELEMENTS TO CREATE OUTDOOR SPACE, AND THAT'S KIND OF AN IMPORTANT CONSIDERATION HERE.
I I NEVER LIKED THE IDEA OF LINING UP THE ADDITIONS BEHIND THE ORIGINAL LIKE CARS BEHIND A TRAIN BECAUSE IT, IT'S NOT INTERESTING ARCHITECTURALLY AND IT DOESN'T ALLOW US TO CREATE OUTDOOR SPACE.
SO BY CREATING THIS L-SHAPED PLAN, ESSENTIALLY WE'RE ABLE TO CREATE SOME OUTDOOR SPACE THAT'S DEFINED BY THE BUILDINGS.
IF WE DON'T HAVE THE BUILDINGS DEFINING THAT, THEN TO CREATE THAT SENSE OF SPACE, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A WALL OF A ARB ES OR SOMETHING EQUALLY AS OFFENSIVE TO ME, I HATE OUR VINES.
UM, I WOULD RATHER USE THE BUILDINGS TO DO THAT BECAUSE WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO, UM, THE POSITION OF THE GARAGE BUILDING, WHICH SEEMS TO BE THE THING THAT THE, UH, PLANNING REPORT DISAGREES WITH THE MOST IS FOR A COUPLE OF REASONS BESIDES THE ONES I'VE MENTIONED.
THE FIRST IS THAT IT PUTS IT WHERE THE DRIVEWAY FROM BLACKSMITH LANE IS GOING TO BE THE SHORTEST IT PUTS IT WHERE THE GRADE CHANGE FROM BLACKSMITH LANE TO THE LOWEST POINT ON THE LOT IS THE LOWEST.
AND WHERE THERE'S ALREADY EXIST IN THE A BREAK IN THE EXISTING STONE WALL.
THERE WAS A PHOTOGRAPH, UM, THAT RODDY SHOWED THERE THAT YOU CAN SEE SOME STEPS COMING DOWN FROM THE BACK THAT'S ALREADY A BREAK IN THAT WALL THAT WILL EXPAND SLIGHTLY TO GET THE DRIVEWAY IN THERE.
AND IT ALSO PLACES THE DRIVEWAY THE FURTHEST FROM ALL OF THE COMMERCIAL PARKING LOTS THAT ARE DIRECTLY ACROSS BLACKSMITH LANE.
THERE'S THE PIZZA PLACE AND A COUPLE OTHER BUSINESSES THERE.
THIS ACTUALLY PUTS IT BETWEEN TWO PARKING LOTS, SO WE'RE NOT PULLING IN AND OUT DIRECTLY ACROSS THE STREET FROM THAT COMMERCIAL PARKING LOT.
UM, I THINK MORE IMPORTANTLY THOUGH, WHAT THIS ARRANGEMENT, UH, WHY I THINK THIS ARRANGEMENT IS APPROPRIATE IS BECAUSE IT IS IN KEEPING WITH THE COMMON DEVELOPMENT PATTERN THAT ALREADY EXISTS IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
AND THAT'S WHAT THESE IMAGES ARE SHOWING.
SO I, I PUT TOGETHER A COLLECTION OF DIFFERENT PROJECTS THROUGHOUT THE, UH, DISTRICT THAT ARE IN THE SAME ZONING DESIGNATION AS THIS ONE.
AND ALL OF THESE ARE PROJECTS WHERE THE MAIN BUILDING IS ADDED ONTO IN A SERIES OF LITTLE ACCRETIONS ON THERE.
AND SOMETIMES THEY'RE DIRECTLY CONNECTED, SOMETIMES THEY'RE CONNECTED BY LOWER PIECES.
WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE OUR THREE MASSES VERY SEPARATE FROM EACH OTHER.
THERE'S ANOTHER PAGE ON THIS IF YOU CAN GO TO THAT.
ANOTHER EX WHOOP, WAS THAT THE SEC? THERE'S THE SECOND ONE.
SO ANO TWO OTHER EXAMPLES ON THAT.
AND AGAIN, THE MAIN HOUSE IN SOME CASES IS AT LEAST IN THE PLAN VIEW, NOT THE DOMINANT MASS.
UM, THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT OR WRONG, IT JUST MEANS THAT'S WHAT IT IS AND IN SOME CASES IT IS.
IN THIS ONE, BECAUSE THERE ARE NO AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHS OF THIS YET, THESE ARE THE TWO HOUSES AT 17 AND 27 NORTH RIVERVIEW.
THE DARKER SECTION IS THE ORIGINAL HOUSE.
THE LIGHTER SECTIONS ARE THE ADDITIONS.
AND AS YOU CAN SEE HERE, JUST SIMPLY MOVING THE BUILDING BEHIND THE EXISTING BUILDING IN PLAN VIEW, UM, ISN'T REALLY A GOOD WAY TO, TO DETERMINE WHETHER IT'S SUBORDINATE OR NOT.
SO, UH, WHAT YOU'RE SEEING HERE IS ADDITIONS THAT WORK WITH THE EXISTING BUILDING IN A NUMBER OF DIFFERENT WAYS.
UH, A COUPLE MORE EXAMPLES OF HOW THIS IS DONE IN A COUPLE OF BUILDINGS.
THE ONE ON THE TOP LEFT IS, OR TOP RIGHT IS A COMPLETELY NEW HOUSE, BUT IT DOES THE SAME THING BY BREAKING IT INTO SEVERAL MASSES AND THEN CONNECTING THEM.
AND THE ONE ON THE LOWER LEFT IS ON SOUTH HIGH STREET AT UM, UH, DOWN WHERE THE BARN IS DOWN THERE.
AND YOU CAN SEE THAT THIS IS A NEW PROJECT, BUT THERE ARE, UH, AN ADDITION ON THE WHAT, WHAT READS AS AN ADDITION ON THE, ON THE TOP OF THAT.
AND AN EXISTING BUILDING IN THE BOTTOM BOTH EXTEND BEYOND THE FRONT OF THE EXISTING BUILDING.
SO WE'RE NOT ASKING ANYTHING THAT'S NOT ALREADY PRETTY PREVALENT DOWN HERE.
SO WHAT I'M SHOWING YOU HERE IS THE DRAWING THAT RODDY ALREADY SHOWED YOU AND I THREW IN THE BOTTOM ONE TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT TWO THINGS.
THE, THE EXISTING BUILDING AND THE LEFT MOST MASS ARE THE SAME HEIGHT, THE SAME SCALE, ALMOST THE SAME SIZE ACTUALLY.
AND THEY'RE BOTH ONE AND A HALF STORIES.
THE ONE ON THE LEFT DOES HAVE TWO DORMERS
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ON IT, BUT THE MAIN MASS IS STILL THE ONE AND A HALF STORY MASS.AND THEN THE TWO ELEVATIONS ABOVE ARE THE HOUSES AT 27 AND 17 NORTH RIVER VIEW.
AND AS YOU CAN SEE THERE, THE ADDITION, ESPECIALLY THE ONE ON 17 IS SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER THAN THE, UH, EXISTING HOUSE.
AND THE ONE AT 27, IT'S A LITTLE BIT HIGHER.
WE'RE NOT PROPOSING TO DO THAT AGAIN ON THIS ONE.
BUT AGAIN, THIS IS A CONDITION THAT ALREADY EXISTS AND WAS ALREADY APPROVED IN THE DISTRICT.
UM, WE THINK OUR MASSING MEETS THE INTENT OF 4.12.
UH, IT'S 40 FEET BEHIND THE MAIN HOUSE AND ITS LOCATION, MATERIALS AND OVERALL SIMPLICITY DIFFERENTIATE AND SEPARATE THESE MASSES FROM THE MAIN HOUSE.
AS I MENTIONED, THE GARAGE IS A STORY AND A HALF, NOT TWO STORIES, AND IT'S LOWER THAN THE ORIGINAL.
UM, THERE WAS A COMMENT ABOUT THE FENESTRATION ON THE ADDITIONS, UM, AND I, I'D JUST LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT IF WE'RE TRYING TO CREATE ADDITIONS THAT DISTINGUISH THEMSELVES FROM THE ORIGINAL BUILDING, I'M NOT SURE WHY WE'RE TRYING TO MIMIC THE FENESTRATION PATTERN OF THE EXISTING BUILDING.
I THINK OUR FENESTRATION PATTERN IS SIMILAR IN SOME CASES, BUT VERY DIFFERENT THAN OTHERS.
AND I THINK THAT'S PART OF DISTINGUISHING THE, UH, EXISTING OR THE NEW ADDITIONS FROM THE EXISTING.
I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.
ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS REGARDING THE PRESENTATION? UM, COULD YOU GO BACK TO THE HOUSES, THE OVERVIEW, THE SATELLITE VIEW IF YOU WILL, OR OVERHEAD VIEW OF THE HOUSES ON RIVERVIEW THAT YOU'RE CITING? UH, GO FURTHER BACK, UM, AND TELL US THE ADDRESSES.
I I DON'T RECOGNIZE THOSE HOUSES FROM ABOVE THE DRAWINGS OR THE AERIAL PHOTOGRAPHS.
THESE PHOTOS RIGHT HERE THAT WE HAVE? UH, YEAH, THESE RIGHT HERE.
SO THOSE ARE ALL ON SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET.
I DON'T HAVE THE ADDRESSES IN FRONT OF ME.
BUT THEY'RE ALL ON SOUTH RIVERVIEW AND EACH SLIDE SAYS WHAT STREET THEY'RE ON.
SO THE FIRST ONE WOULD BE, UM, I BELIEVE THAT'S ACROSS THE LANE FROM THIS HOUSE.
THE ADDRESSES ARE ON THAT SLIDE.
YEAH, SEE WHERE SPRING HILL IS? MM-HMM
YEAH, SO YOU CAN TELL UM, THIS ONE AT EBERLY, THIS ONE WOULD BE THE ONE ACROSS EBERLY FROM OUR HOUSE.
I THINK THAT'S SCHMIDT'S HOUSE, ISN'T IT? IN THE LOWER RIGHT.
AND THEN THE LOWER RIGHT IS UM, AND I'M SORRY, DID YOU SAY THAT'S UH, KURT'S HOUSE? I THINK THAT'S KURT'S HOUSE, YEAH.
WHICH WE ALL KNOW THE ZONING WAS CHANGED BECAUSE THE MASSING WAS ENDED UP NOT BEING EXACTLY WHAT WE WANTED THERE, SO I WOULD NOT USE THAT ONE AS AN
BUT THESE OTHER TWO, UM, 63, UM, THOSE IMPROVEMENTS HAVE BEEN MADE IN THE LAST FOUR YEARS.
SO 55 IS THE HOUSE THAT WAS APPROVED UNDER THE NEW CODE REST.
ALL THE HOUSES WERE APPROVED UNDER THE OLDER CODE.
SO 63 WAS BEFORE THE CODE? YEAH.
SO THE ONLY ONE THAT'S BEEN APPROVED UNDER THIS NEW CODE WOULD BE THAT VERY FIRST ONE IN THE LEFT HAND CORNER, 55.
AND IT'S ACROSS FROM THIS PROPERTY.
AND THEN I THINK THE NEXT SLIDE SIMILARLY, THERE YOU GO.
UH, SO 1 0 9 WOULD BE, UH, THE ONE ACROSS FROM KURT, THAT'S HIS SON'S HOUSE THAT WITH THE ITALIAN EIGHT IN THE FRONT.
YEAH, I THINK 1 0 9 IS THE PENNY HOUSE, IS THAT RIGHT? YEAH.
THE ORIGINAL BRICK RIGHT BRICK HOUSE, RIGHT? THAT'S CORRECT.
I'M GLAD YOU CAN SEE THOSE ADDRESSES.
I KNOW THEY'RE THERE BUT I CAN'T SEE THEM.
YEAH, THEY ARE, THEY'RE ON THE FRONT OF THEY'RE LIGHT
I DON'T, I'M NOT SURE I DO REC BECAUSE I DON'T SEE ANY OTHER STREETS, SO I CAN'T TELL YOU THAT'S UH, PAUL GATTI'S HOUSE.
AND WAS THAT BEFORE OR AFTER THE CODE? THAT THAT WAS BEFORE THE NEW CODE? THAT WAS ALSO BEFORE THE CODE.
SO THE ONLY ONE THAT'S BEEN APPROVED ACCORDING TO THE NEW CODE WOULD BE 55.
IF WE WERE TO GO BACK THE, THAT ONE IN THE UPPER LEFT HAND CORNER, UH, YOU MENTIONED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT LANDSCAPING.
UM, I NOTICED OUT FRONT THERE'S A BEAUTIFUL TREE THAT'S CHANGING COLORS.
I THINK IT'S A MAPLE RIGHT THERE WITH REMOVAL, THE DRIVEWAY.
ARE THOSE TREES GONNA BE AFFECTED, DO YOU KNOW, OR CAN YOU PREDICT TREES MENTION THIS? THERE IT IS.
[00:25:01]
NOT TOUCHING ANY TREES.IN FACT THE DRIVEWAY LOCATION, IT'S, AND THIS WASN'T INTENTIONAL, IT JUST WORKED OUT THIS WAY IS GONNA BE BETWEEN THE ONLY TREES THAT ARE ON THE BACK PROPERTY LINE WHERE THOSE STEPS ARE BACK THERE MIGHT LOSE A LITTLE SCRUB TREE, BUT NOTHING SIGNIFICANT BACK THERE.
AND DID I SEE MENTION ABOUT THIS STONE WALL? I REALIZE THAT THAT'S NOT A HISTORIC STONE WALL, BUT THAT'S ALSO GOING TO, UH, RUN UP ALONG THE DRIVEWAY OR DID I READ THAT IN THE PACKET? I BELIEVE SO.
THE, THE VIEW OF THE STONEWALL FROM BLACKSMITH, THERE'S ACTUALLY A CONCRETE CURB THERE.
SO YOU SEE ABOUT THAT MUCH CURB AND THEN ABOUT THAT MUCH STONEWALL STICKING ABOVE THAT FROM MY CLIENT'S SIDE, YOU SEE A COUPLE OF FEET OF STONEWALL.
OUR INTENT IS TO, WHEN WE OPEN THAT UP A LITTLE BIT, IS TO BRING THAT STONEWALL ALONG THE SIDES OF THE DRIVEWAY AS IT GOES DOWN ABOUT A FOOT AND A HALF, TWO FEET DOWN TO THE LOWER LEVEL THERE.
TERRY, YOU HAVE A QUESTION? YEAH, I DO.
SO 55, YOU SAID THAT WAS APPROVED UNDER THE NEW CODE MM-HMM
AND I'M ASSUMING, I'M LOOKING AT, 'CAUSE I WASN'T HERE AT THE TIME, I'M LOOKING AT THIS GARAGE ON THE LEFT, THAT'S PART OF THE ADDITION, IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT.
AND IT EXTENDS SIGNIFICANTLY BEYOND THE SIDE OF THE HOUSE? THAT'S CORRECT.
AND WHEN 55 WAS APPROVED, THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSION JUST TO AVOID JUST HOW 55 IS.
SO THERE WAS A LOT OF BACK AND FORTH AND BOARD DID APPROVE, ALMOST LIKE WITH A WAIVER LETTING IT PROJECT BEYOND THAT.
FIRSTLY JUST BECAUSE HOW IT'S REALLY PUSHED BACK FROM THE FRONT ENTRANCE AND, AND THAT MASS IS VERY COMPARABLE TO WHAT THE ADDITION WAS ALSO DOING.
SO IT WAS NOT LIKE IT WAS A ONE OR ONE AND A HALF STORY HOME AND THE ADDITION IS COMPARABLE TO THAT SIZE OR YOU KNOW, OR MAYBE TALLER.
UM, AND THEN TO AVOID THAT LINEAR LONG MASS, THE BOARD DID APPROVE SO THAT THERE IS AN INTERESTING CHARACTER TO THAT HOUSE.
AND IN THE UM, RICHARD, YOUR STATEMENT THAT THE, UH, HEIGHT OF THE ADDITION OF THE ONE AND A HALF STORY GARAGE WAS THE SAME AS THE HEIGHT OF THE EXISTING HOUSE.
I THOUGHT IN THE STAFF, UH, INFORMATION YOU HAD INDICATED THAT THERE WAS AN ISSUE ASSOCIATED WITH THE, THE TERRAIN, THE HEIGHT OF THE TERRAIN, AND IT, EVEN THOUGH THE BUILDING ITSELF WAS THE SAME HEIGHT, RODDY, IF I'M, IF I MAY, HIGHER GROUND AND IT PROJECTS ABOVE THE, THE EXISTING HOUSE.
SO WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THIS HEIGHT, RIGHT? YES, YES.
SO STAFF HASN'T RECEIVED THE SECOND FLOOR PLAN OF THAT EDITION.
HOWEVER, I THINK AT THE OFFICE HOURS IT WAS EXPRESSED THAT THAT IS GOING TO BE A BEDROOM.
AND INITIALLY WHEN STAFF HAS RECEIVED IT, IT'S AN OCCUPIED SPACE.
HOW WE ARE COMPARING IN THE HEIGHT NOW IT'S COMPARABLE BECAUSE HOW IT'S SHOWING IS IT SITS RIGHT WHERE ONE AND A HALF STORY ENDS.
BUT THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE'LL HAVE TO EVALUATE AT THE NEXT STEP BECAUSE IF GARAGE IS COMING FROM THE REAR, THE HOUSE RIGHT NOW IS SITTING BELOW THE GRADE LEVEL.
SO AS SOON AS YOU PUT THE FINISH FLOOR LEVEL UP, THIS HEIGHT IS GOING TO GO AND GET INCREASED AND MAYBE GET BEYOND THE EXISTING ONE.
BECAUSE HOW GARAGE SITS DOWN HERE, IF YOU CAN SEE IN THE ELEVATION, IT SITS LOWER THAN THE STREET LEVEL.
ONCE WE ARE DOING THE FINISHED ROW LEVELS, AND THAT'S WHAT OUR REQUIREMENT IS TO PROVIDE THOSE FINISHED ROW LEVELS TO MAKE SURE WHERE IS THE FINISHED FLOOR LEVEL.
SO IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT EXACT SAME HEIGHT, NOT FROM MEASURED FROM THE FLOOR LEVEL, BUT JUST MEASURED HEIGHT, THAT CANNOT BE COMPARABLE BECAUSE THEN THE REAR STRUCTURE IS GOING TO BE TALLER BECAUSE FINISHED FLOOR HEIGHT IS GOING TO COME.
SO HAVING THAT DOCUMENTATION WOULD REALLY HELP US TO EVALUATE WHERE THAT FINISHED FLOOR HEIGHT IS AND THEN TAKING ONE AND A HALF STORIES.
SO I THINK IT'S MORE THAN ONE AND A HALF STORIES, IT'S MORE THE OVERALL HEIGHT BEHIND, BEHIND THAT STRUCTURE.
SO I BELIEVE THE QUESTION FOR US IS, AND THIS IS AN INFORMAL REVIEW, IS THAT WHAT OUR PREFERENCE WOULD BE IS THAT IT WOULD BE AT LEAST AT THE SAME HEIGHT, IF NOT LOWER, AND YOU ARE SHOWING IT AS THE WAY IT'S GOING TO BE BUILT, IT WOULD BE AT THE SAME HEIGHT.
SO WHAT WOULD YOUR RESPONSE BE? CORRECT.
SO THE ORIGINAL COMMENT IN THE PLANNING REPORT WAS MADE BEFORE RODDY HAD THIS DRAWING.
AND I PROVIDED THAT DRAWING TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION.
SO WHAT YOU'RE SEEING IS THE GRADE LINE ON THAT IS THE ACTUAL GRADE ON THE SITE.
UH, AND WE HAVE THE DRIVEWAY LEVEL THERE SITTING AT THE GRADE LEVEL OF THE SITE.
SO, UM, THERE ISN'T ANY REASON THAT WE KNOW OF WHY THE ADDITION WOULD BE ANY HIGHER THAN WHAT WE'RE SHOWING HERE.
OBVIOUSLY THE, THE EXISTING HOUSE SITS QUITE A BIT OUT OF THE GROUND RIGHT NOW AS YOU CAN SEE ON THE, ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE DRAWING.
SO WE HAVE SOME ROOM TO WORK WITH, BUT WE FIDDLED AROUND WITH THE HEIGHTS OF THE SECOND FLOOR WALLS AND THE FIRST FLOOR WALLS QUITE A BIT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE KEPT THOSE HEIGHTS THE SAME.
[00:30:02]
SO WHAT YOU SEE HERE IS WHAT IS HOW THIS WILL LOOK IN THE FINAL DRAWINGS WITH THE ENGINEERING AND EVERYTHING ELSE.WHY DON'T WE, UM, WHY DON'T WE LOOK AT THESE QUESTIONS JUST TO MAKE SURE WE GET ALL THE ANSWERS WE WANT.
SO THE FIRST QUESTION WAS, DOES THE BOARD SUPPORT THE PROPOSED RELOCATION OF VEHICULAR ACCESS TO BLACKSMITH LANE? I SUPPORT IT.
AND HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT IT? MARK, DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR NO, I'M FINE WITH IT.
WHOOPS, I'M GOOD WITH THAT AS WELL.
I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY, UM, APPROPRIATE AND I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND HAVING TO PULL OUT WITH, UH,
SO I THINK THAT'LL BE A GOOD LOCATION FOR IT.
UH, DOES THE BOARD SUPPORT THE PROPOSED MASSING, INCLUDING THE LOCATION, HEIGHT, AND VISIBILITY OF THE ADDITION? SO WE JUST SPOKE ABOUT THE HEIGHT AND AS PROPOSED WE'RE BEING TOLD THAT THE HEIGHT WILL BE THE SAME.
SO, UM, THE MASSING AND THE LOCATION THEN AND VISIBILITY OF THE ADDITIONS WOULD BE THE REST OF THAT QUESTION.
I I'M A LITTLE UNCLEAR AS TO WHAT THE STAFF'S CONCERN IS REGARDING THE SECTION, UH, THAT CONNECTS THE EXISTING BUILDING TO THE ONE STORY ADDITION.
YOU, IS IT, ARE YOU SUGGESTING IT'S TOO SMALL AND, AND IT'S YES.
WIDTH? YEAH, SO STAFF IS SAYING THAT IT IS TOO SMALL IN THE VIRTUE AND HOW TYPICALLY A HYPHEN OR THIS PHYSICAL CONNECTION IS READ IS THAT IT CLEARLY DEMONSTRATES WHAT'S THE EXISTING HOUSE OR THE LANDMARK BUILDING IS OUT THERE AND WHAT THE PROPOSED ADDITION IS OUT THERE.
SO HOW WE SEE THERE IS NOT A LOT OF DEMARCATION BETWEEN THIS AND THIS.
AND THEN SOMETHING LIKE THIS IS ALSO BEING REPEATED CLOSE TO THE GARAGE.
SO THE REAL, THERE IS NO REAL IDENTIFICATION IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, ITS TRANSPARENCY OR ITS MATERIAL OR, OR ANYTHING TO MAKE IT VERY EVIDENT THAT IT IS AN HYPHEN.
DO YOU HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION? BECAUSE I HAVE A QUESTION.
SO, UM, THE LOT COVERAGE BY THE HOUSE IS ALREADY AT 25.3%, IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CORRECT.
AND SO ASKING THEM TO EXPAND, UH, THAT CONNECTION THAT HYPHEN WOULD FURTHER TAKE THEM EITHER, EITHER THEY'D HAVE TO TAKE SOMETHING OFF THE BACK OR IF THEY MAKE THAT BIGGER, THAT WILL FURTHER, UM, EXPAND THE BUILDING FOOTPRINT.
NOW IT'S 0.3 AND IT MIGHT GO TO POINT WHATEVER.
SO I MEAN THAT'S SOMETHING WE WOULD WANNA CONSIDER, BUT I JUST WANNA POINT THAT OUT.
WELL, IF I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, THEY WOULD ACTUALLY, I MEAN JUST IN A, IF YOU JUST LOOK AT IT JUST AS IT IS, THE SUGGESTION IN A VERY SIMPLISTIC WAY IS TO MAKE THE ONE STORY ADDITION SMALLER SO THAT THE HYPHEN COULD BE LARGER.
AND AT THE SAME POINT I ALSO WANT TO CLARIFY THAT BOARD IN THE PAST HAS APPROVED PROJECTION BEYOND THE HISTORIC FACADE.
OUR CONCERN IN THIS CASE IS YES, WE DON'T WANT A LINEAR HOUSE.
WHAT STAFF IS RECOMMENDING THAT HAVING THAT TWO OR ONE AND A HALF STORY DIRECTLY BEHIND THE ONE STORY? SO WHAT YOU SEE FROM THE STORY FROM THE STREET IS NOT TWO ONE AND A HALF STORY STRUCTURES.
YOU SEE ONE STORY AT THE REAR AND THEN A ONE AND A HALF STORY MASS GOES BEHIND THE EXISTING ONE AND A HALF STORY MASS.
SO WHAT YOU SEE FROM THE STORE IS STORE FROM THE STREET IS ACTUALLY THE EXISTING HOME AND SOMETHING THAT'S PUSHED BACK.
UM, THE ONE AND A HALF STORY THAT IS ON HERE IS A TWO STORY THAT IS A BEDROOM.
ARE THERE OTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT HI, THE VISIBILITY OF THE ADDITIONS? 'CAUSE THAT'S WHERE WE NEED TO GIVE FEEDBACK.
I I THINK WE CLARIFIED THE HEIGHT AT LEAST FOR NOW.
UM, I I THINK THE MAJOR ISSUE HERE IS THE LOCATION.
AND AS I LISTEN TO MR. TAYLOR'S COMMENTS, UH, AND AS I WALK DOWN THE STREET AND LOOK AT THE VARIOUS HOUSES AND SEE HOW THINGS ARE LAID OUT, UM, I, I WOULD TEND TO AGREE WITH THE LOCATION AS THEY PROPOSE.
[00:35:02]
O ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUES ON THAT LOT IS THE COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES BEHIND IT.THERE'S A, THERE'S A, UM, THE APOTHECARY BEHIND IT THAT HAS THIS PARKING LOT HAS A VERY NICE PATIO OUT BACK THAT FREQUENTLY HAS PEOPLE ON IT.
AND, UM, I AGREE WITH THE CONCERN THAT THAT GIVES THEM SOME PRIVACY FROM THAT AREA.
UM, I AGREE TOO THAT IT, IT KIND OF FITS THE PATTERN.
UH, I I, GRANTED WE KIND OF TOOK AWAY SOME OF, OF THE EXAMPLES THAT HE PROVIDED, BUT EVEN, YOU KNOW, I LOOK AT THE ELI PENNY HOUSE AND THAT'S, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL HOUSES DOWN THERE AND IT CLEARLY HAS AN ADDITION COMING OUT THE SIDE AND YET IT'S STILL A REALLY TREASURED HOUSE.
IT'S STILL A REALLY VALUED HOUSE.
SO, UM, I WOULD UNDERSTAND IN THIS LOCATION, IN THIS LOT HOW IT WOULD BE HELPFUL FOR THEM TO HAVE THE GARAGE IN THAT LOCATION.
IT MAY NOT BE TRUE FOR EVERYBODY WHO WOULD COME TO US, BUT I THINK IN THIS LOT I I WOULD, I WOULD BE FINE WITH THE GARAGE BEING IN THIS LOCATION.
I DON'T REALLY HAVE ANY CONCERNS ABOUT THE GARAGE.
IT'S THE LOCATION OF THE GARAGE.
IT'S MORE OF THE AMOUNT OF THE SEPARATE INDIVIDUAL HOMES WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT AT THE ANGLE FROM SOUTH BLACKSMITH MM-HMM
AND I JUST, I KEEP WONDERING, UM, THE PALETTE AND THE FINISH SEPARATE.
LIKE IS THERE A WAY TO SIMPLIFY THE ARCHITECTURE SO THAT IT STILL PAYS HOMAGE TO THE ORIGINAL BUILDING BUT IT'S NOT COMPETING AND I FEEL LIKE IT'S COMPETING.
SO WE'RE GETTING INTO AESTHETIC, BUT I AGREE WITH THE GARAGE.
I I I WOULD, I AGREE WITH BOTH OF YOU, BUT I DO THINK THAT THIS BACK VIEW LANE LOOKS LIKE A JUMBLE OF BUILDINGS.
SO, UM, I'D BE CURIOUS AS TO WHAT, WHAT THE USES ARE AND THE WAY IT'S SET, WHY YOU SET IT UP THAT WAY.
RICK, IF YOU COULD JUST TELL ME, BECAUSE I DO LIKE TO HEAR WHAT'S THE INTERIOR SO THAT I UNDERSTAND WHAT THE EXTERIOR WELL YOU HIT ON SOMETHING THAT'S CONCERNING US ALSO.
UM, WE MADE KIND OF A LATE MINUTE CHANGE IN THAT CENTERPIECE AND WE KNOW THAT WE HAVE NOT FULLY RESOLVED THE MASSING ON THAT PART.
RODDY'S COMMENT IN THE PLANNING REPORT ABOUT THAT.
THAT'S THE, THE, SHE DIDN'T USE THESE TERMS. SO THAT'S THE WORST VIEW OF THE HOUSE I AGREE WITH.
UM, AND I, AND I, I DO AGREE THAT THAT NEEDS TO BE CLEANED UP IN TERMS OF THE MATERIALS AND COLORS.
UM, WE HAVEN'T REALLY DISCUSSED THE MATERIALS AND COLORS AT ALL OTHER THAN TO PREPARE A PRESENTATION FOR YOU.
SO, UM, THOSE ARE THINGS THAT WE'RE WIDE OPEN TO, UH, WORKING ON AS WE CONTINUE THIS.
SO YOU HAVE OUR FEEDBACK ON THAT.
I MEAN, I THINK, YOU KNOW, THERE'S DEFINITELY THE PAIRS OF THREE, RIGHT? SO YOU HAVE THE ORIGINAL, YOU HAVE THE GARAGE AND I THINK WHAT COULD BE REALLY INTERESTING ARCHITECTURALLY IS IF THERE'S MAYBE ONE BIG MOVE AND THEN THE TWO, TWO SMALLER PIECES COMPLIMENT AND THERE'S A WAY TO LIKE SIMPLIFY THE ROOF DETAILS BACK TO, UH, MAINTAINING THE ORIGINAL INTENT.
THE OTHER THING I WOULD SAY IS THAT THE MINUTE YOU PUT THE RED GARAGE THERE, THAT'S WHERE YOUR EYE GOES TO.
AND I THINK IN RESPECT TO THE HISTORICAL CONTEXT, I THINK IT SHOULD BE PULLED IN THE, UM, THE STONE WORK COULD BE INTERESTING OR JUST ONCE AGAIN, A VERY NEUTRAL FACADE.
UM, YOU COULD STILL PAY HOMAGE TO THE RED ROOF.
I THINK THAT'S KIND OF QUITE NICE, BUT ALSO, UM, LETTING IT BE MORE IN THE BACKGROUND SO THAT THE ORIGINAL, UM, THE ORIGINAL HOME IS CELEBRATED.
I ACTUALLY HAVE A COMMENT ON THAT.
UM, IN THE, IN THE A RB RESOURCES, WE HAVE THE HISTORIC LISTING OF THE HISTORIC HOMES.
AND THIS IS, UM, LET ME GET THE 25 SOUTH RIVER VIEW IN, IN THE, FROM THE HISTORICAL SOCIETY.
THEY FELT THE HOUSE WAS BUILT IN 1821 AND UM, IT WAS A LOG HOUSE ORIGINALLY, AND THEN LOGS COVERED WALNUT SIDING SAID, SAID TO HAVE BEEN PAINTED RED AT ONE POINT IN TIME.
I, I KNOW PAINT COLORS ALWAYS, YOU KNOW, IT'S A SENSITIVE ISSUE HERE, BUT I FOUND THAT VERY INTERESTING.
AND THEN IT WAS FRANK PENNEY IN THE 1920S WHO WAS A STONE MASON WHO CHANGED IT INTO A STONE HOUSE.
WELL THEN THAT SPEAKS WELL FOR THE RED ON THE ADDITION.
YEAH, I DON'T KNOW THAT I CAN GIVE YOU MUCH.
I, I THINK I'D WANNA SEE HOW YOU'RE GONNA REDESIGN THE BACK THERE BEFORE WE WOULD TALK ABOUT
[00:40:01]
MATERIALS, UM, BECAUSE I THINK THAT WOULD HELP US A LITTLE MORE THAN COMMENTING ON WHAT YOU HAVE HERE.SO, UM, WHAT IS OUR OPINION OF THE ASSOCIATED SITE MODIFICATIONS? AND I ASSUME WE'RE TALKING THERE ABOUT THE POOL, THE LOCATION OF THE CHIMNEY.
UM, I HATE THAT YOU'RE GONNA PUT A POOL THERE BECAUSE MY HUSBAND WISHES WE HAD ONE, SO WE'LL COME DOWN TO YOUR HOUSE.
BUT, UM, HOW DO WE FEEL ABOUT WHERE THE POOL IS? I, I GET THE FEELING BECAUSE EVERYBODY SAID THEY APPRECIATED WHERE THE GARAGE WAS TO GIVE PRIVACY THERE.
I'M ASSUMING BECAUSE OF THE POOL.
HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE CHIMNEY STANDING THERE KIND OF OUT BY ITSELF? I HAVE, UM, A FEW THOUGHTS IF YOU CAN GO BACK TO THAT 3D VIEW THAT SHOWS IT.
UM, THE ONE, THERE'S ONE MORE.
SO WHEN I ORIGINALLY SAW THIS, MY FIRST QUESTION WAS, UM, I AGREE WITH, UM, STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION TO PLACE THE CHIMNEY KIND OF CLOSER ARCHITECTURALLY.
SO THAT IT, TO ME IT, YOUR EYE GOES RIGHT TO IT.
AND THEN MY OTHER QUESTION AND THOUGHT WAS WHY THE JOGGING, WHY THE JOGGING OF THE RAILING? LIKE IT EXTENDS SOUTH OF THE TWO STORY ADDITION, THEN JOGS UP, THEN JOGS OVER.
AND SO IS THERE A WAY THAT THAT COULD BE SIMPLIFIED? SO YOUR EYE, ONCE AGAIN, IT'S JUST MORE OF A BACKGROUND AND WHAT SIZE IS THE POOL TOO? BECAUSE I WAS GUESSING SIX FEET BY FIVE FEET.
OH, HOW ABOUT IT JUST TELLS US
SO IT'S JUST A PLUNGE POOL, SO IT'S NOT WHERE NOBODY'S DOING LAPS IN IT.
UH, WE'VE ALREADY DECIDED TO ELIMINATE THE FIREPLACE IN CHIMNEY COMPLETELY, SO THAT GOES AWAY.
AND AS, AS WE, UH, HAVE DISCUSSED ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS, THE LOCATION OF THE POOL WAS REALLY IN THERE FOR HELP TO HELP US CALCULATE THE LOT COVERAGE.
AND WE DIDN'T GIVE MUCH THOUGHT TO WHERE IT WOULD BE RIGHT NOW.
YOU COULD JUMP OUT OF THAT WINDOW INTO THE POOL AND IT'S PROBABLY NOT A GREAT IDEA.
SO THE POOL IS GONNA CHANGE NOT, UM, AND THE PATIO CONFIGURATION WILL CHANGE TOO.
I ASSUME THE REASON THE CHIMNEY WAS ORIGINALLY THERE IS BECAUSE IT WAS GONNA BE A WHOLE PATIO AND THAT'S PROBABLY WHERE YOU PLAN TO ENTERTAIN.
WELL, WE, WE TALKED ABOUT ALL THE THINGS WE'D WANT TO HAVE BACK THERE.
AND I, WE MAY END UP WITH A FIRE PIT INSTEAD OF A OR OR NOTHING OR A GRILL.
THAT'S A MINOR ISSUE IN THE WHOLE SCHEME OF THINGS FOR US AT THIS POINT.
WELL, I MEAN, YOU HAD IT OUT THERE, IT SOUNDS LIKE IT MIGHT HAVE, I UNDERSTAND SOMETHING YOU WANTED IN AN OUTDOOR WE HAVE, IT'S, IT'S VERY NICE TO HAVE THAT.
BUT MAYBE IF IT WAS, I, I WONDERED EVEN IF, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE INTERIOR OF THIS MIDDLE BUILDING IS, IF IT WAS UP AGAINST THAT SIDE, BUT MAYBE THAT WOULDN'T WORK ARCHITECTURALLY.
BUT IF YOU ALREADY REMOVED IT, YEAH, IT'S OUT.
DO WE HAVE ANY SWIMMING POOLS IN THIS S WORK? RESIDENTIAL DISTRICT? MM-HMM
YOU DO? MY ONLY CONCERN ABOUT SWIMMING POOLS IS JUST FENCING AND PRIVACY.
UM, I THINK POOL WOULD BE GREAT.
UM, UH, IT IS ALL LIMESTONE DOWN THERE.
IT'D BE TOUGH DIGGING, BUT IF, UH, I THINK THAT'S SOUNDS GREAT.
BUT JUST TO REITERATE WHAT YOU WERE SAYING, YOU WERE QUESTIONING ABOUT IF, IF MAYBE THE, THAT FENCE LINE COULD JUST BE STRAIGHT, NOT JOG ON AROUND.
YEAH, I WOULD JUST TAKE IT FROM THE TWO STORY ADDITION, GO ALL THE WAY ACROSS THAT SOUTH LINE AND THEN INSTEAD OF JOGGING IT, I WOULD JUST CLEAN THAT UP.
SO IT'S A REALLY NICE CLEAN RECTANGLE.
BECAUSE THEN TO ME ARCHITECTURALLY IT'S IN LINE WITH THE EDGE OF THE GARAGE MM-HMM
AND THERE'S SOME INTENTIONALITY AROUND THE ARCHITECTURE THAT IT'S SPEAKING TO.
TERRY, DID YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS? UH, I'M GOOD WITH, WITH THAT AND I, I, I LIKE THE IDEA OF MOVING THE POOL TO A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT LOCATION EXACTLY WHERE YOU DETERMINE THAT TO BE.
BUT YEAH, I THINK IT, THERE'S BETTER OPTIONS.
IS IS EVERYBODY FINE IF YOU WILL, WITH THE SHED? UH, GABLES ON THE ONE AND A HALF STORY EDITION? YOU MEAN THE BACK? ANY ISSUES THERE? THIS BACK ONE.
I'M NOT NECESSARILY, YEAH, I OPPOSED TO IT.
I'M JUST ASKING IF THERE'S ANY ANYBODY THAT ANYBODY HAD A REACTION TO TO THAT.
I, I THINK WE HAD SIMILAR QUESTIONS WITH THE HAN RESIDENTS, DIDN'T WE? MM-HMM
[00:45:01]
IT HAD TO DO WITH THE SIZE OF THE WINDOWS, BUT I DON'T RECALL.
AND THAT, THAT IS SOMETHING WE DIDN'T ADDRESS, UM, IN THE STAFF REPORT.
UM, THERE WAS CONCERNS ALSO ABOUT THE WINDOWS, BUT I SUPPOSE AGAIN, THAT WILL COME WHEN YOU REDESIGN HOWEVER YOU'RE GONNA REDESIGN THE BACK.
I I AM NOT, AS LONG AS IT'S THE WHOLE BUILDING IS SUBORDINATE MM-HMM
I I I BELIEVE THEIR UH, THEIR ARGUMENT OR THEIR, THEIR POINT THEY MADE WAS THAT THERE ARE QUITE A FEW OTHER HISTORIC BUILDINGS AROUND DUBLIN THAT HAVE THAT SHAPE.
ARE THERE OTHER DISCUSSION POINTS OR CONCERNS OR FEEDBACK WE WANNA GIVE? NO, I THINK THAT'S IT FOR ME.
NO, I HOPE THIS WAS HELPFUL FOR YOU.
ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS YOU HAVE OF US BASED ON WHAT WE'VE CON WE'VE DISCUSSED ALREADY? NO, THIS WAS EXCELLENT.
WERE THERE ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS? PERFECT.
UH, NONE ON THE PHONE, BUT I BELIEVE SOMEBODY WISHES TO SPEAK.
MR. BENNY, WOULD YOU LIKE TO SPEAK
HELLO, MY NAME'S DAVID VINNY, 56 SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET.
I JUST WANTED TO RAISE A CONCERN ABOUT, UM, NOT THAT I'M OPPOSED TO IT, BUT THE SITE PLAN COMING OFF BLACKSMITH LANE, AS YOU'RE AWARE, LISA, LIKE STORM WATER'S AN ISSUE IN OUR AREA.
AT HILL GETS WASHED OUT AND THE WAY THAT GUTTER SYSTEM WORKS IS ALL THAT WATER FROM THE COMMERCIAL AREA COMES DOWN AND IT WILL EITHER HIT THE SPRING HILL GUTTER OR THE, UH, SPRING HILL AND BLACKSMITH GUTTER OR I GUESS SEWAGE PIPE OR THE, UM, SPRING HILL, SOUTH RIVERVIEW STREET WHERE OUR HOUSE IS SITUATED.
WE GET EVERYTHING THAT BYPASSES THOSE, WHICH IS A LOT.
I'VE RAISED THIS ISSUE TO THE CITY A NUMBER OF TIMES ABOUT THE WATERFALL THAT FORMS IN OUR PROPERTY BECAUSE OF THE STORM WATER.
SO I'M JUST WORRIED IT, IF THERE'S GOING TO BE ANY ABATEMENT, ONCE YOU INTRODUCE ALL THAT WATER UNDER THE PROPERTY, WHERE'S IT GOING TO GO? MM-HMM
UM, SO THAT'S MY MAIN CONCERN.
AND YOU KNOW, I DON'T HAVE AN ISSUE WITH PEOPLE COMING FROM BLACKSMITH LANE.
OBVIOUSLY THE OTHER HOUSES, UM, TO THE SOUTH HAVE THE SAME THING, BUT THEY'VE GOT A TRENCH BY THEIR DRIVEWAYS THAT TAKES THE WATER AWAY.
SO AS LONG AS THAT GETS AWAY FROM SPECIFICALLY MY HOUSE, IT DOESN'T CREATE MORE EROSION, THEN I'M, I'M FINE WITH THAT.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT'S ADDRESSED AND THOUGHT ABOUT.
YEAH, NO, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT BECAUSE WE NOT ONLY GET WATER, BUT WE GET ROCK.
THE WASH OUT FROM EVERYBODY ELSE BAD.
THE WASH OUT FROM EVERY SINGLE STORM.
SO EVERYTHING HIGH STREET ACTUALLY PROBABLY A LITTLE BIT, UM, PAST HIGH STREET JUST ALL COMES DOWN MM-HMM
RIVER REVIEW, SO THAT WATER NEEDS TO BE DEALT WITH ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.
DO YOU LIVE AT THE END OF BLACKS? UH, OR AT THE END OF, UM, OH GOSH, THE ALLEY THAT COMES DOWN THERE.
I'M TRYING TO, IN MY MIND, LOCATE WHERE YOUR HOUSE IS.
SO I'M RIGHT ON THE RIVER RIGHT NEXT TO THE PARK, SO THE LAST HOUSE BEFORE THE BRIDGE.
SO THE WATER COMES DOWN AND THEN THAT ACCESS ROAD BECOMES LIKE THE LAST PLACE FOR THE WATER TO GO AND THAT GOES DOWN OUR PROPERTY AND CREATES A BIG DIVOT AND A NICE WATERFALL DURING A HEAVY RAIN.
BUT IT'S NOT SOMETHING I REALLY WANNA HAVE AS YOU KNOW, THE, UM, HOUSE NEXT TO THE VESSELS THEY'VE PUT IN THE DRAIN.
AND SO MAYBE THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WHEN THIS GETS DEVELOPED SHOULD BE DONE AS WELL.
YOU CAN SEE IT, IT'S ALONG THE ROAD BEFORE YOU GET TO THE DRIVEWAY.
IT WOULD STOP THE WATER ALSO FROM GOING INTO YOUR DRIVEWAY AND INTO YOUR, UH, GARAGE.
AND MY MAIN REQUEST WOULD BE IT BE ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THE PROPERTY.
I JUST WENT OUT THERE TODAY WITH A LEVEL, AND UNLESS YOU'RE ON THE FAR NORTH SIDE OF THE PROPERTY, IT RUNS SOUTH.
AH, THERE'S A, A DRAIN AT THE END OF, UH, SOUTH RIVERVIEW BY THE BRIDGE THAT'S PROBABLY UNDERUTILIZED.
SO THAT WOULD BE MY PREFERENCE IF IT COULD GO THAT WAY.
THIS IS SOMETHING THAT PROBABLY NEEDS TO BE BROUGHT UP AGAIN WITH THE CITY
IS THERE SOMEONE WE CAN REFER THAT TO FOR THE CITY FOR HIS CONCERNS? THE DRAINAGE FOR THIS SPECIFIC PROPERTY WILL BE LOOKED AT AS PART OF THE NPR AND THEN THE LARGER AREA I REALLY CAN'T SPEAK TO OTHER THAN ENGINEERING'S AWARE OF IT AND PEOPLE HAVE LOOKED AT IT AND IT'S, IT'S A VERY DIFFICULT BALANCING ACT.
IT ACTUALLY, WHEN OUR HOUSE WAS ORIGINALLY BUILT, SAME THING HAPPENED.
[00:50:01]
THE HOUSE AND SO THEY HAD TO FIND WAYS TO MITIGATE THAT.WELL, UH, THERE'S YOUR FEEDBACK.
WE LOOK FORWARD TO BRINGING IT FORWARD AGAIN.
[COMMUNICATIONS]
UH, WE'RE GOING TO MOVE ON.UH, I'LL TURN IT OVER TO SARAH REGARDING DISCUSSION OF PRE-APPROVED PAINT COLORS.
I DON'T HAVE A PARTICULAR PRESENTATION PREPARED FOR YOU, BUT WE DID PROVIDE YOU WITH A MEMO WITH A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY ABOUT THE PAINT COLOR DOCUMENT AND HOW WE GOT THERE AND, UM, SOME OF THE, THE EFFORTS THAT WENT INTO PREPARING THAT DOCUMENT.
AND THEN WE PROVIDED A LITTLE BIT OF ANALYSIS ON WHERE WE THINK WE HAVE BEEN WITH RECENT APPLICATIONS, UM, INCLUDING SOME IDEAS THAT WE HAVE FOR IMPROVEMENTS.
AND THEN WE HAVE SOME DISCUSSION QUESTIONS TO KIND OF GUIDE WHERE THE BOARD MIGHT WANNA GO.
SO IS IT FOR ME TO READ THE QUESTIONS? SURE.
OR I'M HAPPY TO, I'M HAPPY TO READ THEM.
SO RECOGNIZING THAT COLOR IS A HIGHLY VISIBLE AND EASY WAY FOR BUILDINGS TO BE COMPATIBLE WITHIN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, WHAT LEVEL OF COMFORT DOES THE BOARD HAVE WITH REVIEWING COLOR? I, I WOULD SAY THAT'S ONE OF OUR MAIN FUNCTIONS.
UM, I THINK COLOR IS A VERY SUBJECTIVE, UM, UM, PART OF THE, THE PART OF THE HOUSE.
AND, UH, I THINK THIS IS ARISING BECAUSE THE MOST RECENT APPLICANT WHO, UH, WE RAISED THE QUESTION OF THE 1890 TO 1940, OR I THINK THAT TIMEFRAME'S RIGHT? OR 1891 TO 1940, AND THE COLOR THAT HE HAD CHOSEN WAS CONTRA TO WHAT THE TEXT, THE VERBIAGE WAS IN THAT SECTION.
AND, UM, SO I THOUGHT OUR ROLE WAS IMPORTANT.
AND THE QUESTION HE ASKED THAT REALLY I TRIPPED OVER WAS, UH, WHAT YOU'RE CHOOSING OR QUOTE UNQUOTE POPULAR COLORS, AND THAT'S IN 5.2.
UM, AND YET HE WANTED A COLOR THAT HE FELT EXISTED THEN, BUT WASN'T NECESSARILY A POPULAR COLOR.
SO THAT'S WHAT TRIPPED ME UP THE MOST ON THAT CASE.
AND THAT'S WHY I WAS SUPPORTING, THAT'S WHY I SUPPORTED WHAT HE HAD CHOSEN.
I THINK THAT'S A REASONABLE REQUEST.
I I, I THINK IT'S A REASONABLE THING FOR THE STAFF TO BRING THAT TO THE A RB FOR US TO TALK ABOUT.
I LOOK BACK AT THE MINUTES THAT OF WHEN COLORS WERE DISCUSSED, AND IT SEEMED LIKE IT WAS A REAL STRUGGLE.
IT SEEMED LIKE IT WAS VERY DIFFICULT TO DECIDE WHAT TO DO.
AND I HAD THIS SENSE ALMOST THAT THE BOARD IN THE END SAID, OKAY, WE'RE JUST PUTTING, THIS IS DONE.
UH, WE'RE NOT GONNA REVISIT THIS ANYMORE.
AND THERE WERE A COUPLE COMMENTS MADE THAT THEY, THEY DISCUSSED, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING, SOME THINGS ARE ECLECTIC AND, UH, I LIKE THE WORD ECLECTIC.
UM, IN FACT IT'S IN 5.2, I THINK TWICE.
SO WHEN I THINK OF ECLECTIC DOWN IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, I I THINK OF THINGS LIKE TICKY WINGS, FACE ON THE STONE WALL, YOU KNOW, OR, UM, THESE, WE'RE NOT TRYING TO REPLICATE WILLIAMSBURG HERE.
UH, I THINK WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE THINGS ALL FIT IN TOGETHER AND LOOK GOOD REALIZING THAT PROPERTY, THESE ARE PROPERTY OWNERS ARE COMING TO US WITH THEIR HOUSE THAT THEY'RE PROUD OF, THAT THEY, YOU KNOW, THEY WANT TO RENOVATE AND, AND KEEP IN GREAT SHAPE.
I APOLOGIZE IF I'M RUNNING OVER MY THREE MINUTES
I THINK YOU GET TO HAVE MORE THAN THREE MINUTES, BUT I'LL, I'LL, I'LL CONCLUDE IT BY SAYING, YOU KNOW, IN THOSE CONVERSATIONS THAT THEY HAD HERE WITH THE BOARD, UM, COUNCILWOMAN CRAM SAID IT BEST.
I THINK SHE, WHAT THEY WANTED TO AVOID IS FUNKY END OF THE SPECTRUM COLORS.
AND, AND I THINK THAT'S OUR, THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT WE SHOULD BE USED FOR.
UH, IF SOMEBODY WANTS A COLOR IN THIS FELLOW'S CASE, IT WAS WITHIN THE APPROVED COLORS,
[00:55:01]
BUT BY THE DESCRIPTION, IT WAS OUTSIDE OF THE APPROVED COLORS IN THE TEXT, AND YET THAT COLOR WOULD'VE BEEN AVAILABLE FOR 'EM.AND, UM, I I THINK THAT'S REASONABLE FOR US TO BE ASKED.
I DON'T THINK THAT'S A FAILURE OF THE STAFF.
UH, I DON'T THINK IT'S PUNITIVE TO THE APPLICANT.
UH, I THINK, UH, I'M IN FAVOR OF KEEPING OUR COLOR THE COLOR CHOICES AS THEY'RE WRITTEN AS THEY ARE.
MANY PEOPLE WILL LOOK AT THOSE GUIDELINES AND SAY, OKAY, I GET IT.
THEY REALIZE THEY'RE BUILDING OR BUYING A HISTORIC HOME OR RESTORING A, UH, THEIR OWN PROPERTY THAT'S HISTORIC.
UM, BUT OTHERS MAY HAVE REASONABLE CHOICES THAT AREN'T UNQUOTE UN POPULAR, UH, BUT YET ACCEPTABLE.
I I THINK THE, I I THINK WE SHOULD BE DISCUSSED.
I THINK IN THAT INSTANCE, UH, HIS ARGUMENT WAS, WANT A SYNTAX OF THE SENTENCE, HONESTLY, SYNTAX OF THE SENTENCE.
SO, YOU KNOW, IT TALKED ABOUT, UM, THE COLORS AND THE KINDS OF COLORS.
AND I THINK WE WOULD, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU READ THE SENTENCE, YOU WOULD ASSUME THE GRAY THAT WAS MEANT IN THAT SENTENCE WAS, UM, WHAT IS, WHAT ARE THE COLORS THERE? UM, NOT PALE
YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I, WHAT I REMEMBER.
IT WAS, UH, THERE WAS CONFUSION AMONG WHAT IS GRAY, BASICALLY.
AND IT'S BECAUSE, SO THAT PART WAS UNCLEAR, BUT WHAT WASN'T UNCLEAR WAS THE TRIM THAT WAS CRYSTAL CLEAR, BUT WE AUTHORIZED THE CHANGE IN THE TRIM.
UM, BUT IF THE QUESTION HERE IS, UM, SHOULD WE ENTER INTO A DISCUSSION ABOUT REVIEWING THE COLORS, RIGHT, THAT, I MEAN, I I HAVEN'T BEEN ON THIS BOARD VERY LONG, SO I'M, I I WANT TO BE CAUTIOUS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, JUST LIKE JUMPING TO MY IMMEDIATE REACTION.
BUT I DO HAVE AN IMMEDIATE REACTION TO SOME DEGREE.
I, I THINK MAYBE THEY'RE ALL COMPLETELY HISTORICALLY ACCURATE, BUT I WOULD SAY IN SOME CASES THEY'RE PRETTY BLAND TOO AS WELL.
SOME OF THE HOUSES THAT ARE RECENT ARE JUST KIND OF, EH, AND I RECOGNIZE THAT THE SAME TIME.
WE DON'T WANT THE CRAZY EXTREMES.
YOU KNOW, I, I LIKE SOME VARIETY.
I, I THINK THE RED, FOR EXAMPLE OF THE OLD TAVERN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE ADDRESS IS OR THAT'S REALLY A, A NICE ADDITION TO THE COLOR SPECTRUM.
I'M NOT SURE IF THAT'S EVEN A PERMITTED COLOR, IF YOU KNOW WHICH BUILDING I'M TALKING ABOUT.
THE, UH, BUT ANYWAYS, I JUST, I THINK IF THEY'RE ALL KIND OF TANS AND BROWN AND WHITE, NO, I KNOW WHITE, IT'S JUST A LITTLE BORING.
YOU DIDN'T AFTER A WHILE, DIDN'T WEAR MASK WHITE.
SO, BUT I DO THINK THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE CLARITY IF WE ARE ASKED TO MAKE THE DECISION BASED ON THE ERROR OF THE HOUSE, IF WE'RE HOLDING TRUE TO THAT, THERE SHOULD BE CLARITY IN THE COLORS PROPOSED WITH THE ERROR OF THE HOUSE SO THAT THERE'S A RANGE FOR THE HOMEOWNER TO CHOOSE FROM, TO YOUR POINT, TERRY.
BUT ALSO PROVIDES ENOUGH VARIETY SO THAT WE CAN POINT BACK IT AND SAY, WELL, THIS IS THE RANGE WE GAVE TO LIGHT GRAY OF WHAT WE THINK THAT HISTORIC CONTEXT MEANS, AND THAT DOES NOT FIT IN.
AND THAT WAS MY STRUGGLE WAS LIKE, IN A WAY, WE WERE SAYING TWO DIFFERENT THINGS AND AT THE END I, I DID SIDE WITH HIM.
SO THAT WOULD HELP GIVE I THINK US MORE GUARDRAILS IN SAYING, HERE'S THE RANGE AND HERE'S THE ZONE, HERE'S YOUR FREEDOM TO SELECT WITHIN THAT.
SO WHAT I HEAR YOU SAYING, AND I THINK IS WHAT I WANTED TO GET TO IS A CLEAR, A LITTLE BIT CLEARER.
HERE'S THE RANGE, THESE ARE THE COLORS.
AND I THINK HE, UM, AND I'LL TELL YOU MY NEIGHBORS, SOME OF THEM ARE LIKE, HEY, THAT LOOKS GREAT.
AND SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE, OH, I HATE THAT.
UH, AND ONE OF MY NEIGHBORS IS SITTING HERE RIGHT ACROSS FROM THAT HOUSE.
SO, UM, I, I THINK WHAT HE DID IS HE WENT ON, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE THE FIRST, THE WAY THE SENTENCE WAS WRITTEN, HE SAID, WELL, GRAY'S OUT HERE AND THIS IS A GRAY AND THIS COULD POTENTIALLY BE, AND WAS THIS REALLY MADE DURING THAT TIME? AND, UM, BUT I, I PERSONALLY THINK WE SHOULD, WE SHOULD BE MAKING THOSE.
MAYBE WE NEED MORE, UM, WHAT YOU'VE SAID WE NEED, UM, MORE OF THE COLOR PALETTE, ALL OF
[01:00:01]
THEM RIGHT IN FRONT OF US WHEN WE'RE HAVING THOSE CONVERSATIONS.YEAH, I'VE SEEN IT BEFORE WHERE, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, WHEN THE, THE HOUSE IS BUILT AND THERE'S A TIMELINE AND THERE'S A COLOR RANGE WITHIN EACH OF THE HISTORIC TIMEFRAMES.
AND THAT WOULD BE FOR THE TRIM AND FOR THE PAINT OF THE HOUSE OR THE COLOR OF THE HOUSE.
I'D RATHER SEE THE ACTUAL COLORS THAN JUST THE NAMES OF THE COLORS
AND I REALLY APPRECIATED THAT HE WAS, UM, TAKING CARE OF THAT HOUSE AS I WALKED BY IT AND REVIEWED IT.
AND SO I MAY HAVE COMPROMISED SOMEWHAT ON THAT BECAUSE I KNEW I WANTED THE HOUSE FINISHED.
AND I, I GOTTA TELL YOU, TERRY, I I REMEMBER YOU SAYING THAT, AND I WAS AN ERROR AND NOT THINKING ABOUT THE COLOR OF THE TRIM.
I WAS SO WRAPPED UP ABOUT THE COLOR OF THE HOUSE THAT THE TRIM WENT COMPLETELY OVER MY HEAD.
AND I'M AFRAID, UM, WHAT YOU SAID, WE DIDN'T ACKNOWLEDGE WELL ENOUGH, IT'S NOW FOR SALE.
AND I, YOU KNOW, THIS IS THE, THE TRICKY THING ABOUT PAINT.
THIS DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH IT FOR SALE, BUT I THOUGHT THAT WHEN I SAW IT PAINTED THAT IT WAS DARKER THAN WHAT WE HAD APPROVED.
WHETHER IT WAS OR NOT, I DON'T KNOW BECAUSE THAT'S, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE HAVE A PAINT SWATCH.
IS THAT, IS THAT THE SAME? I ASSUME SOMEBODY CHECKS THAT, BUT, UM, YEAH, I SAW IT WAS FOR SALE.
WHICH BRINGS UP, YOU KNOW, HOW WHEN YOU CAN GO TO SHERWIN WILLIAMS AND YOU CAN TAKE IT, AND THEN YOU CAN PICK THE PAINT AND IT'LL WASH IT SO THAT YOU CAN SEE WHAT IT WOULD ACTUALLY LOOK LIKE.
NOW, ONCE IT WAS PAINTED, I WALKED DOWN THERE ANYWAY, EVEN, YOU KNOW, THAT NOT THE SAME AS ACTUALLY SEEING IT.
I MEAN, I'VE CERTAINLY PAINTED THE INSIDE OF MY HOUSE MANY TIMES AND SAID, WELL, THAT'S NOT THE COLOR.
I THOUGHT IT WAS, I PAINTED SOMETHING ELSE
AND ONE OTHER THING I NOTICED JUST IN REVIEWING ALL THESE DOCUMENTS IS THAT I THINK EVERYBODY WHO, AND FIRST OF ALL I WANT THANK THE STAFF AND THANK THE FORMER BOARDS FOR WHAT THEY DID.
UM, BUT EVERYBODY WAS ON THAT BOARD THAT MADE THOSE DECISIONS.
I, I DON'T THINK IS ARE ANY LONGER ON THE BOARD
UH, I THINK OF THE HOMEOWNER, IT HAS A HOUSE, THEY WANT TO PAINT IT.
AND YOU KNOW, IT MAKES ME WITH CAUTION THINK ABOUT AS PEOPLE COME TO US WITH THEIR HOUSE COLORS SPECIFICALLY AND THEY WANT TO DO SOMETHING TO REALIZE THEY'RE GONNA BE THE ONES LIVING WITH IT A LOT LONGER THAN WE WILL.
'CAUSE IT'S LIKELY OUR TENURE ON THE BOARD IS NOT GOING TO EXCEED THE LIFE OF THAT COLOR OF THE HOUSE.
BUT I, BUT I WILL SAY HAVING LIVED THERE, I GET TO SEE IT EVERY DAY.
UM, OKAY, SO, UM, WHAT SPECIFIC REORGANIZATION OPPORTUNITIES, I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU MEAN BY REORGANIZATION OPPORTUNITIES.
SO COULD YOU SHARE WITH ME WHAT YOU MEAN BY THAT? YOU BET.
SO WE HAD A COUPLE OF THOUGHTS AND ONE WAS ON THE TIMELINE THAT YOU HAVE, THERE'S KIND OF ARBITRARY 50 YEAR MARKS, UM, STARTING AT 1800 AND IT MIGHT HELP INSTEAD OF USING THOSE MARKS TO TIE IT BACK TO THE ACTUAL SECTION.
SO 1861 TO 1890, YOU KNOW, BASED ON THE CHAPTERS SO THAT YOU CAN SEE A LITTLE BIT MORE WHERE YOU ARE IN THE TIMELINE.
SO THAT WAS ONE IDEA THAT WE HAD.
AND THEN ANTHONY PUT TOGETHER THIS SAMPLE SECTION 4.0 TO SHOW HOW WE COULD BREAK THIS APART WHERE YOU COULD SEE IN FRONT OF YOU ALL THE BODY COLORS THAT CAN BE APPROVED RIGHT AWAY AND SEE WHAT THE COLORS ACTUALLY ARE AND THEN GO TO THE TRIM AND IN SOME CASES THE SASH COLORS.
AND THEN WHAT THAT DOES IS A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT THINGS.
IT MAKES IT A LOT EASIER TO USE THE DOCUMENT.
YOU'RE NOT FLIPPING THROUGH IT TRYING TO CROSS REFERENCE, BUT IF SOMEBODY DID COME IN WITH SOMETHING THAT WAS IN THIS CASE VERY DARK, YOU COULD HOLD IT UP AGAINST THAT AND SEE IMMEDIATELY THAT IT IS QUITE DIFFERENT THAN THE COLORS THAT STAFF CAN ADMINISTRATIVELY APPROVE.
[01:05:01]
AND IS THAT SOMETHING THAT PEOPLE GET? DO THEY GET AN ACTUAL COLOR CHART OR ARE THEY JUST GETTING COLOR NAMES? WELL, THESE COLOR NAMES ARE IN THE BACK OF THE DOCUMENT, BUT WITH EACH SECTION IT IS JUST LISTED WITH THE NAMES.SO WE THOUGHT THAT IT MIGHT BE HELPFUL FOR EACH SECTION TO SHOW THE ACTUAL COLORS IT WOULD BE.
AND IN A WAY WHAT I LOVE THAT YOUR TEAM IS DOING IS CREATING A KIT OF PARTS.
SO FOR THE BODY OF THE HOME, HERE ARE YOUR OPTIONS FOR THE TRIM, HERE'S YOUR OPTIONS.
AND I THINK TO ME THAT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE.
AND EVEN WITHIN THAT, IF YOU WANTED TO, YOU COULD BREAK IT DOWN ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE BY THE YEARS SO THAT IT'S SUPER, SUPER, SUPER CLEAR BECAUSE THEN THAT'S ENOUGH JUSTIFICATION FOR US TO MAKE THOSE DECISIONS.
AND I EVEN STRUGGLED WITH THAT BEING NEW TO THIS BOARD OF LIKE, OKAY, HOW DO WE DIGEST ALL OF THIS WITHIN THE SAME, UH, BETWEEN THE DIFFERENT ERRORS? SO MM-HMM
ANYTHING ELSE SARAH ON THIS? WOULD THAT, IF WE REORGANIZED IN THIS MANNER THAT WE JUST TALKED ABOUT IN TWO DIFFERENT WAYS, WOULD THAT GIVE YOU ADEQUATE COMFORT? DO YOU THINK, UM, YOU KNOW, FOR THE NEXT TIME THAT SOMETHING THAT WE CANNOT APPROVE ADMINISTRATIVELY COMES BEFORE YOU? DO YOU THINK THAT MIGHT? YES.
SO WHAT WE CAN DO IS, UM, CONTINUE TO WORK ON THIS.
THIS IS, UM, HONESTLY IT'S EVEN JUST THIS ONE SECTION HAS BEEN VERY LABOR INTENSIVE
SO, UM, PERHAPS BY THE END OF THE YEAR WE COULD HAVE SOMETHING DRAFTED FOR YOU TO TAKE A LOOK AT AND THEN WE CAN GO THROUGH THE PROCESS TO GET THAT UPDATED AND ADOPTED.
UM, IF WE'RE DONE WITH THAT DISCUSSION, I ONLY HAD ONE OTHER TOPIC TO COVER AND UM, THIS WOULD BE JUST AS A REMINDER AS YOU'RE WALKING THROUGH THE DISTRICT AND TAKING A LOOK AT VARIOUS, UM, APPLICANT ADDRESSES, BE SURE TO HAVE YOUR BADGE WITH YOU.
UM, WE'VE HAD SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THAT LATELY ABOUT VARIOUS PEOPLE LOOKING AND TAKING PICTURES AND STUFF.
AND SO WE JUST WANNA BE VERY CLEAR THAT, UM, HAVE YOUR BADGE.
YOU WANNA SHARE MY EXPERIENCE? I'D LIKE YOU GUYS TO THINK ABOUT THE INCENTIVES THAT YOU'RE CREATING, UM, WITH THESE PAINT COLOR CHOICES.
I KNOW WITH OUR HOUSE BEING BUILT IN 1978, NOT HISTORIC, WE HAD SEVEN COLORS TO CHOOSE FROM ALL, LIKE TERRY SAID, WE'RE KIND OF A SOULLESS NEUTRAL AND IT WAS JUST LIKE, WHAT ARE OTHER OPTIONS? WE COULD PAINT IT WHITE AGAIN.
SO THAT'S WHAT WE DID BECAUSE I REALLY DON'T FEEL LIKE GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS OF EXPLAINING WHY I WANT THIS COLOR.
LIKE I JUST, IT'D BE NICE TO HAVE MORE BREADTH OR MORE OPPORTUNITIES.
ESPECIALLY, IT'S HARD FOR ME TO BELIEVE THAT THAT ERA FROM 1941 TO 1990 HAS THE FEWEST COLORS AVAILABLE FROM ALL THE ERAS THAT ARE COVERED IN THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.
SO I WOULD RECOMMEND BEING MORE EXPANSIVE WITH THIS IF YOU CAN JUST BECAUSE LIKE WHY WOULD YOU WANNA BE IN THE POSITION OF HAVING TO SELL PEOPLE? WE DON'T WANT TO GIVE YOU THIS COLOR.
IT'S LIKE, OR LIKE TRYING TO JUSTIFY THAT THAT SHADE OF BLUE IS NOT QUITE THE SHADE OF BLUE WE WANT TO HAVE HERE.
SO THE MORE OPPORTUNITIES THAT YOU CAN PROVIDE TO THE RESIDENTS, THE FEWER CASES YOU'LL HAVE TO DEAL WITH THIS.
AND IT CAN JUST BE AN ADMINISTRATIVE, ADMINISTRATIVE SOLUTION WHERE WE CAN JUST GET GOING.
'CAUSE ANOTHER THING IS THE TIME THAT'S INVOLVED, LIKE WHEN I WANT TO PAINT, I WANT TO PAINT.
I DON'T HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL I GET APPROVAL AND THEN LIKE JUST LIFE HAPPENS.
AND IF I CAN'T MAKE THAT MEETING, IT GETS BUMPED A MONTH, ANOTHER MONTH.
IT JUST SEEMS FRUSTRATING AND AS A RESIDENT TO BE HEMMED IN THIS MUCH, AND ESPECIALLY FOR NOT HAVING HISTORIC HOME, TO NOT HAVE BASICALLY MANY OPTIONS AT ALL.
SO IT'S JUST FRUSTRATING TO BE ON THIS END OF IT.
I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT WHEN YOUR HOUSE WAS BUILT IN 1968
UM, IF THERE'S NO FURTHER ANNOUNCEMENTS AND I HAD A QUESTION ABOUT SOMETHING SURE.
I WAS WONDERING ABOUT THE, UM, THE OLD OSCARS BUILDING, THE NORTH FACADE.
WE HAD APPROVED THAT LARGE WINDOW AND THERE'S NO LARGE WINDOW
[01:10:01]
THERE.WHAT HAPPENED WITH THAT ON 20 NORTH? UH, I DON'T REMEMBER THE ADDRESS, BUT IT, IT'S IT'S ON NORTH, SOUTH, ON THE SIDE.
SO WHAT HAPPENED WAS THEY FOUND THAT THERE IS SOME KIND OF SUPPORT BEAM RIGHT IN THAT LOCATION WHERE THE LARGE WINDOW WAS GOING TO GO IN.
SO THEY'RE HAVING TO PIVOT A LITTLE BIT AND WE ARE TAKING A LOOK AT AN ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVAL RIGHT NOW AND IT WILL ESSENTIALLY GO BACK TO MORE OF WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY APPROVED.
WE DON'T HAVE TO VOTE ON ADJOURNMENT.
WELL THEN WE'RE ADJOURNING AT, UH, SEVEN 40 SOMETHING THREE